I want to suggest that the Lama’s use of “love” and “compassion” are not found in Buddhism, but used in the Judeo-Christian sense (borrowed in other words) because Eastern metaphysics lack such thought. The Dalai Lama may do this out of ignorance of his own belief, or out of wanting to pull on Western heart strings of compassion (honed itself by the Judeo-Christian ethic), which is often followed by monetary support. Here is a discussion I had with a Buddhist apologist about such thinking, it is taken from my chapter, Reincarnation vs. Laws of Logic:
One of my very favorite quotes deals with the founders of the great religions and the consistency found in these founders:
The nine founders among the eleven living religions in the world had characters which attracted many devoted followers during their own lifetime, and still larger numbers during the centuries of subsequent history. They were humble in certain respects, yet they were also confident of a great religious mission. Two of the nine, Mahavira and Buddha, were men so strongminded and self-reliant that, according to the records, they displayed no need of any divine help, though they both taught the inexorable cosmic law of Karma. They are not reported as having possessed any consciousness of a supreme personal deity. Yet they have been strangely deified by their followers. Indeed, they themselves have been worshiped, even with multitudinous idols. All of the nine founders of religion, with the exception of Jesus Christ, are reported in their respective sacred scriptures as having passed through a preliminary period of uncertainty, or of searching for religious light. Confucius, late in life, confessed his own sense of shortcomings and his desire for further improvement in knowledge and character. All the founders of the non-Christian religions evinced inconsistencies in their personal character; some of them altered their practical policies under change of circumstances. Jesus Christ alone is reported as having had a consistent God-consciousness, a consistent character himself, and a consistent program for his religion. The most remarkable and valuable aspect of the personality of Jesus Christ is the comprehensiveness and universal availability of his character, as well as its own loftiness, consistency, and sinlessness.
Robert Hume, The World’s Living Religions (New York, NY: Charles Scribner’s Sons, 1959), 285-286.
An example of a self-refuting/incoherent worldview that deals a bit with Eastern philosophy/religion comes from A Handbook for Christian Philosophy, by L. Russ Bush. After giving a basic definition of what a worldview is, Dr. Bush goes on to explain how differing worldviews can interpret reality and then he applies some first principles to the matter:
…most people assume that something exists. There may be someone, perhaps, who believes that nothing exists, but who would that person be? How could he or she make such an affirmation? Sometimes in studying the history of philosophy, one may come to the conclusion that some of the viewpoints expressed actually lead to that conclusion, but no one ever consciously tries to defend the position that nothing exists. It would be a useless endeavor since there would be no one to convince. Even more significantly, it would be impossible to defend that position since, if it were true, there would be no one to make the defense. So to defend the position that nothing exists seems immediately to be absurd and self-contradictory.
 “A worldview is that basic set of assumptions that gives meaning to one’s thoughts. A worldview is the set of assumptions that someone has about the way things are, about what things are, about why things are.” L. Russ Bush, A Handbook for Christian Philosophy (Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan, 1991), 70.
I will say here that Buddhism and Christianity agree that the proper relation in a marriage situation is a male and female. But many “Western “adherants” to Buddhism do not know what they are saying when statements are made about Buddhism being “such-and-such.” Two short videos are perfect for setting up an excerpt from my book:
So here is a portion of my chapter dealing with Eastern Thought:
So to say the Dalia Lama or the Buddha are “Christ like” is to wholly misunderstand the chasm of differences in the two completely different leaders of these religions… and their logical conclusions. Also worth noting is that the date between writings, and so the possibility of corruption of the text is vastly different between the two faiths. For instance, the Buddha is said to have dies around (using the earliest date) 400 B.C.. The earliest portion of a Buddhist writing is dated at about 179 A.D. So let us compare this:
I write about the early attestation to the New Testament in the first 16-pages of my chapter on Gnosticism and Feminism. But I reworked Kenneth Boa’s graphic on comparing dating of ancient texts with some updated information not only cataloged via the aforementioned chapter from my book, but also from here, and the books:
- Norman L. Geisler, Baker Encyclopedia of Christian Apologetics (Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books/Academic, 1999);
- Carsten Peter Theide and Matthew d’Ancona, The Jesus Papyrus: The Most Sensational Evidence on the Origins of the Gospels Since the Discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls (New York, NY: Galilee DoubleDay, 1996).
(I edited the last column under “Date Written” and “Time Span”)
Below is some of the evidence for the early dating of the New Testament.
More on this from Dr. Geisler:
Take note as well that the earliest Church Fathers quoted Scripture… which would need to be completed and widely used by then:
Ignatius of Antioch would be another prime example.
Effectively the above information updates this older Josh McDowell graph here. In other words, we know the early history of Christianity because of the wealth of evidence behind certain events. For instance:
“Pharisaic Judaizers come down to Antioch (Acts 15:1, 5) in the late summer of 49 A.D. and teach that circumcision is necessary before a person can be saved. Paul, Barnabas, Titus and certain others (Galatians 2:1-2) are sent to Jerusalem to confer with other apostles, elders and brethren concerning the relationship between circumcision and salvation. This gathering is commonly referred to as the Jerusalem Conference. This conference occurs in the Fall of 49 A.D. around the time of the Feast of Tabernacles (Acts 15:2).”
We know this because of the evidence… the same evidence to say that two letters describing the eruption of Mount Vesuvius are considered history.
Buddhism lacks this historical attestation and predictive power that the New Testament has in that the original texts are much closer to the events that happened. In fact, the New Testament is superior to ALL ancient documents in this respect.
✞ “…but test all things. Hold on to what is good” (I Thessalonians 5:21);
✞ “Dear friends, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to determine if they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world” (1 John 4:1);
✞ “Test yourselves to see if you are in the faith. Examine yourselves. Or do you yourselves not recognize that Jesus Christ is in you?—unless you fail the test[a]” (2 Corinthians 13:5 — [a] “unless you are disqualified” or “you are counterfeit”).
✦ “As we’ve seen more people in this country have been killed by rightwing extremists that radical Islamist extremists.” (Gateway Pundit)
A great story on some of these and more can be found at The Blaze, and excoriates the media for their participation in this smear.
Okay, I have been wanting to do this for a while, which is, transfer some info from a cadre of old blogs to update the topic into one post that I can reference in the future. Keep in mind that some of the links are long dead. Blogs come-and-go. I am trying to stay. I will continue to post “bios” like this… it was at first a refutation of the legacy media who were immediately connecting many of these shooters to the T.E.A. Party, but an interesting pattern emerges. Also, when dealing with the media we are dealing with THIS type of bias:
Elliot Rodgers (May 2014)
The newest addition to this crappy list, is Elliot Rodgers. Elliot is the the son of Hunger Games assistant director Peter Rodgers. Now of course Elliot didn’t go on a killing spree in the name of liberalism. And I believe that he, like many of the others, had a screw loose. But, I bet he came from a secular, liberal, Hollywood style upbringing that offered him nothing greater outside himself to battle the “natural man.” In fact, the ONLY political affiliation he chose to associate himself with both on his YouTube and FaceBook is the left-wing political talk show, The Young Turks.
Here is how TYT is described via Gateway Pundit:
- The Young Turk describes itself as “a young progressive or insurgent member of an institution.”
- The host of the channel Cenk Uygur is a far left political activist and former MSNBC host.
All I am saying is that Fox News wasn’t on his list. I looked both at his FaceBook and YouTube “likes,” and there were no religious or conservative interests in this young man. Nothing greater than nature challenging him to reign in feelings and test them with ethical religious mores. Moving on… and now I will go from the older posts to the more recent ones I have posted on over the years. I will concentrate mainly — but not exclusively — to murderers the media almost immediately blames the right on.
James Lee (September 2010)
The Guardian notes that
James Lee, the man police identified as the gunman who entered the headquarters of the Discovery Channel and took a group of hostages, was a self-styled eco-warrior and author of a manifesto describing humans as “the most destructive, filthy, pollutive creatures” destroying the planet.
Lee waged a one-man campaign aimed at forcing the Discovery Channel to run programmes encouraging human sterilisation and wildlife preservation….
Here’s a sample of Lee’s manifesto:
Humans are the most destructive, filthy, pollutive [sic] creatures around and are wrecking what’s left of the planet with their false morals and breeding culture.
For every human born, ACRES of wildlife forests must be turned into farmland in order to feed that new addition over the course of 60 to 100 YEARS of that new human’s lifespan! THIS IS AT THE EXPENSE OF THE FOREST CREATURES!!!! All human procreation and farming must cease!
It is the responsibility [sic] of everyone to preserve the planet they live on by not breeding any more children who will continue their filthy practices. Children represent FUTURE catastrophic pollution whereas their parents are current pollution. NO MORE BABIES!
Now isn’t this fascinating. James von Brunn , the white-supremacist suspect in the Holocaust Memorial Museum shooting in which the guard who was shot has now tragically died, describes the relevance of evolution to his sick thinking. He’s obsessed with “genetics.” He writes in his manifesto (emphasis added):
An interesting aside. Dr. George Tiller, who was a women’s health physician, and performed legal abortions. was gunned down in his church by an anti-abortion zealot. Here is how NewsBustrers wrote about the story then:
First Day Contrast: Keith Olbermann Called Tiller Shooting ‘Terrorism’ And A ‘Jihad,’ But Avoided Those Terms For Fort Hood.
On June 1 of this year, MSNBC host Keith Olbermann devoted most of his hour of Countdown to his withering outrage at the shooting of late-term abortionist George Tiller in Kansas (and how it was caused by Fox News).
The tone was dramatically different than his tone on November 5, the night of the Islamic terrorist shooting rampage at Fort Hood in Texas. Here’s Olbermann’s very dry opening: “Nightmare at Fort Hood: How could a soldier kill at least 12 other soldiers and wounded at least 31 more? And why?”
We know Mr. von Brunn hates:
- Rupert Murdoch
- Fox News
- George W. Bush
- John McCain
- Weekly Standard
- Iraq War
- believed that 9/11 was an “inside job.
The bias is palpable.
The gunman identified by authorities in the Pentagon shooting, harbored intense anti-government feelings.
After the Christian Science Monitor and Talking Points Memo (TPM) connected Bedell to the Tea Party… real evidence started coming out in which I asked this question: “How many Tea Partiers or conservatives…”
- Shoot at the Pentagon and hate the military?
- Are registered Democrats?
- Hate George Bush and the whole Bush family?
- Think 9/11 was perpetrated not by Muslims but by Republicans?
- Grow and smoke marijuana?
- Read left-wing anti-Bush books?
- Are anti-war?
- Talk about “economic justice”?
- Think the Vietnam War and the Iraq War were not merely mistakes but were part of a government conspiracy?
…Michelle Malkin uncovered a key inconvenient fact which doesn’t quite fit this predictable “right-wing extremist” narrative — that Bedell was a registered Democrat.
Bedell was also a marijuana smoker, grower and activist, as documented at Gateway Pundit.
Patterico has now posted a full transcript of one of Bedell’s internet rants — the same one cited by Talking Points Memo as evidence of his right-wing leanings — which has Bedell uncorking phrases like “economic justice” and paragraphs like (writing in 2006 during the Bush presidency) “This organization, like so many murderous governments throughout history, would see the sacrifice of thousands of its citizens in an event such as the September 11th attacks, as a small cost in order to perpetuate its barbaric control. This collection of gangsters would find it in their interests to foment conflict and initiate wars throughout the world in order to divert attention from their misconduct and criminality. The true nature of such a regime would find its clearest expression in Satanic violence currently ongoing in Iraq.” and anti-war conspiracy theories like “The political and military disasters such as the wars in Vietnam and Iraq that an illegitimate coup regime uses against the people…”.
Add all that to the previous discovery already linked above that Bedell’s Amazon “Wish List” featured the the left-wing conspiracy-theory books The Immaculate Deception: The Bush Crime Family and Family of Secrets: The Bush Dynasty, the Powerful Forces That Put It in the White House, and What Their Influence Means for America.
And finally, from Gateway Pundit:
Another guy the press immidiately tried to connect to the T.E.A. Party. It was pointed out that much of what the IRS Joseph “the bomber” Stack talked about was directly from Michael Moore movies.
The man suspected of intentionally crashing an airplane into a Texas office building today appears to have posted a lengthy online diatribe attacking the Internal Revenue Service and declaring that, “I know I’m hardly the first one to decide I have had all I can stand.”
The things said in his manifesto seem to all be taken straight from Michael Moore movies?
- Anti-health care system= Sicko
- Anti-Capitalism= Capitalism, a Love Story
- IRS cronyism with businesses= Capitalism, a Love Story
- Anti-Bush= Fahrenheit 9/11
- Blames Big Corporations for job issues= The Big One
One – Joe Stack was a liberal. As I pointed out recently ~ Stack:
- Hates George W. Bush and his “cronies”
- Hates Big Pharma
- Hates Big Insurance
- Hates GM executives
- Hates organized religion
- Refers favorably to communism
- And in his last words before dying, denigrates capitalism.
James Holmes (July 2012)
Good Morning America speculated:
Stephanolpoulos: I’m going to go to Brian Ross. You’ve been investigating the background of Jim Holmes here. You found something that might be significant.
Ross: There’s a Jim Holmes of Aurora, Colorado, page on the Colorado Tea party site as well, talking about him joining the Tea Party last year. Now, we don’t know if this is the same Jim Holmes. But it’s Jim Holmes of Aurora, Colorado.
Stephanolpoulos: Okay, we’ll keep looking at that. Brian Ross, thanks very much.
Bridge Bomb Plot
….Facebook profile, he lists his political views as “anarcho-communist,” and lists “#OccupyCleveland” as his employment.
also, in his “liked” section just a few organizations he apparently endorses:
- Mid Ohio I.W.W.
- Northwest Ohio I.W.W.
- Green Party Watch
- Sherrod Brown, the senior United States Senator from Ohio and a member of the Democratic Party.
- West Side Cleveland Food Not Bombs
- Poor People’s Economic Human Rights Campaign
- Occupy Cleveland
There are more bios of the above clowns HERE.
(H/T Christian Huber) Via The Blaze:
Moonbattery comments on this case:
- …Thandiwe took the liberal propaganda the entire country has been marinating in for decades at face value. Like Colin Ferguson, he was sufficiently unstable to be set onto a maniacal killing spree by the vile poison of politically correct ideology.
This deranged far left shooter. A LGBT volunteer carrying bag of Chick-fil-A sandwiches shot up the conservative Family Research Center in August 2012. The armed man who walked into the Washington headquarters of the Family Research Council and shot a security guard was later identified as Floyd Corkins, 28, of Virginia. Fox News reported that Corkins posed as an intern and was carrying a Chick-fil-A bag with him during the attack. He admitted he got his information from the far left Southern Poverty Law Center website.
- Corkins said he intended to “kill as many as possible and smear the Chick-Fil-A sandwiches in victims’ faces, and kill the guard.” The prosecutor said they reviewed the family computer and found that he identified his targets on the Southern Poverty Law Center’s web site.
And a good commentary comes from Wintery Knight:
….Militant atheism may also be a factor in the shooter’s motives. Nietzsche is the well-known atheist philosopher who decried the “slave morality” of Christianity and proclaimed “God is dead”. The shooter in the Garielle Giffords case (Jared Lee Loughner) was a militant atheist. Militant atheists like Richard Dawkins and the American Atheists group have even called for the eradication of Christianity. But the vast majority of atheists are not violent.
On the other hand, aggressive violence is forbidden to authentic Bible-believing Christians because Jesus did not shed anyone’s blood. Authentic Christians debate and persuade using evidence, because that’s what Jesus did. The most we could do is participate in a just war like the Korean War or the Gulf War. Christians stopped slavery. Christians save unborn babies. We’re for strict non-violence.
American Power Blog has more on the left’s continued smearing of the Family Research Council as a “hate group”:
More from Kerry Picket, “Human Rights Campaign posted Ryan would speak at ‘hate group’s annual conference’ day before shooting at FRC.” And At Twitchy, “Dangerous: Left screeched about Ryan speaking at ‘hate group’ FRC; HuffPo labels FRC hate group again.” And, “Shooting at Family Research Council, suspect in custody; Update: Bomb squad enters building; Update: Mitt Romney issues statement; Update: Shooter ID’d.”
More at Legal Insurrection, “HuffPo attacks Family Research Council just hours after shooting.”
At this point, I think that anyone who uses the word “hate” to describe supporters of traditional marriage should be careful that they are not inciting anyone to violence. We have to do more to promote tolerance and oppose anti-Christian / anti-conservative bigotry on the extreme left. Almost no one on the right calls people who disagree with them names like “hater”. …
What is being reported as Mr. Dorner’s manifesto not only endorses Hillary Clinton for president in 2016 and vigorously defends Barack Obama and the Democrats’ current gun control push; he also savages the NRA’s Wayne LaPierre while expressing all kinds of love for some of the biggest stars in the left-wing media — by name.
Nope, not a T.E.A. Partier.
Wait. I don’t understand… if Sarah Palin draws targets on a map for important Democratic races, and she is tied with violence via the shooter of Gabrielle Giffords (via the flyer to the right). Then at what point is the press responsible for the wild accusations they make?
RightWing News has a few quotes to make the point:
- “These teabag bastards, who by the way, I just wish they would all go away, or like in Passover, I just wish there was an angel of the Lord that would pass over, instead of killing the first born in all the households of Egypt, just wipe out all the teabaggers. Just, you know, the terrible swift sword, just (Malloy emulates sound of sword cutting repeatedly through the air) lop their heads off.” — Mike Malloy
- “They want to put y’all back in chains!” — Joe Biden
- “The land on which they [the Founders] formed this Union was stolen. The hands with which they built this nation were enslaved. The women who birthed the citizens of the nation are second class….This is the imperfect fabric of our nation, at times we’ve torn and stained it, and at other moments, we mend and repair it. But it’s ours, all of it. The imperialism, the genocide, the slavery, also the liberation and the hope and the deeply American belief that our best days still lie ahead of us.” — Melissa Harris-Perry
- “That really bothered me. You notice (Romney) said anger twice. He’s really trying to use racial coding and access some really deep stereotypes about the angry black man. This is part of the playbook against Obama, the ‘otherization,’ he’s not like us. I know it’s a heavy thing, I don’t say it lightly, but this is ‘niggerization.’” — Touré
Here is a short list as well from NewsBusters:
So MSNBC contributor Melissa Harris-Perry said conservatives romanticize the Confederacy as a time “where black people knew their place.” Olbermann accused conservatives of “sanitizing secession” to ignore slavery. Matthews suggested that opposition to ObamaCare had “Republicans on the right talking like antebellum southerners,” and called appeals to federalism as “code” for racism. Lawrence O’Donnell characterized Arizona legislation as a “new sort of secession bill.” Maddow stressed that it was “important that Republican governors keep” commemorating Virginia’s role in the Civil War, and guest Julian Bond wondered at Virginia’s “canine-like affection for the Confederacy.”
Breitbart starts to paint a picture for us about the shooter
And Gateway Pundit begins to paint a picture of the media:
And, here is the updated article, sans “socialist.”
Of course this goes with the LONG list of violent leftists shooters, as my “BIO’s” at my old site and my new site show. Here are more examples of edited parts of the story that has been built about this shooter… why edit this stuff out? Unless you are shamed that the shooter is giving what you believe in (as most journalists and editors at major newspapers do) a bad name.
The below comes via the I.J. Review, in a piece entitled: “Denver Post Shamefully Omits Key Detail About Arapahoe High Shooter,” the emphasized portions were removed.
Robert Lewis Dear, Jr.
Robert Lewis Dear, Jr. from Hartsel, Colorado is registered to vote in Park County, Colorado as a woman. And his party affiliation is UAF!
- UPDATED INFO: UAF may stand for “Unaffiliated,” thanks to Trevor Stewart for the kind correction!
- UPDATED INFO: Typical Christian Conservative: Killer Robert Lewis Dear Was Into Spanking, Bondage and Smoking Pot
The pictured voting gender below is from IJReview:
Maybe society will deal with the instability of people who suffer GID (gender identity disorder)? I pray for the families involved of the death of their loved ones.
But — this site (beyond the compassion felt for lost loved ones) is also a site to defend against the craziness out there. I have seen stupid posts by people who hate Planned Parenthood saying they do not care if a worker at PP lost their lives, to the media saying this is a right-wing motivated attack. All of it dumb. But when the media (not bloggers or tweeters ~ see one example below) hops in on this, then I post rebuttals like this one below.
Robert Lewis Dear, Jr. from Hartsel, Colorado is registered to vote in Park County, Colorado as a woman. And his party affiliation is UAF!
The pictured voting gender below is from IJReview:
Example from Jezebel… this site blames in part the undercover videos released. Even claiming these are edited — even though they have been released in full [without any edits] for the skeptics to watch.
Of course there many “false flag” (not in the conspiratorial sense that is used) arson, poop swastikas, and graffiti against lesbians ~ by those who then claim “hate” has been used against them or their community.
One of the commentators on Jezebel’s site said the following:
The following details a conversation that never really finished. The reason is because many who claim the mantle of Christianity (whether truly saved or not, only God knows) often times do not accept the words or positions given to them ~ clearly ~ in the Bible. And while we do not know the heart of those who claim to be Christ followers, when they start to rip out parts of Scripture, not accepting others, thinking portions of it has been changed over time, allegorizing still other portions of it… you can tell that someone else is sitting on the throne of their heart and not their savior.
I have a couple of neighbors who are dear friends, but one can only try to talk about baseball and movies and TV shows so much. Engaging in challenging discussions about worldviews and Christian accountability, is what I like. These lack of deeper conversations has really kept us neighbors, not sojourners to a better place.
I finally bit-the-bullet due to the many “interventions” on my FaceBook via this neighbor’s brother (who himself is a friendly acquaintance). I have become more bold with my neighbor and her brother in regards to topics that do not deal with cute, fluffy kittens. The internet already has enough of those.
Being a “Christian” means something… and it has never been a libertarian island of self. Never. So, one of these important worldview discussion came by way of the Pope recently saying — at least in sensationalized headlines — that God is not “a magician, with a magic wand.” I guess there was no “magic wand” involved in Jesus’ Resurrection either? CBS even went further to note that,
- “Galileo Galilei could have used Pope Francis. The church branded the astronomer a heretic for arguing that the Earth revolved around the sun.”
I swear, people do not know history well. But that dumb historical statement on part of CBS is-neither-here-nor-there.
Theistic evolution is not compatible with the Bible. It just isn’t. And much like atheists and skeptics I deal with, I have come to the firm conclusion that while they have read an uncountable number of fiction books, they have never walked into a Christian book store and bought and read a single book by a person who specializes in making proper distinctions between Intelligent Design, theistic evolution, and evolution. Because neo-Darwinian theory is not compatible with the Christian faith, no matter H-O-W much one tries to fit the square peg through the round hole.
A Longer Presentation That Hash Out Theistic Evolution/Neo-Darwinian Failures
At any rate, I engaged in conversation to try and get a person[s] who is not use to having meaningful conversation about personal subjects such as faith to engage and engage in a way that their stated beliefs would have to have a logical conclusion. A consequence. If they cannot follow this deduction, then there is a cog in the wheel somewhere. You will see where.
What follows is that discussion [minus names to protect privacy and edited for aesthetic purposes and ease of use here ~ with commentary] where I try and get the people involved to latch onto the ideas of the Author of the universe, CLEARLY presented in the Bible. Here is the conversation, and note that if you are regular church goer how this conversation would have gone differently in your mind:
RT, I will do this here instead of on your Facebook. It will be a series of pretty easy questions. There is a point… but it requires honest dialogue. It may seem too simple and come across as demeaning… it is not meant to be. LKD may want to watch or be involved as well. It is partly based on this point in an aforementioned book, here is the page[s] I am thinking of (click to enlarge):
We ~ as Christians ~ should enjoy deep conversation about our Savior that yes, may even challenge our own opinions. It may not change them, but for heaven’s sake (*said like a gray haired older grandma with care and concern*), to insulate oneself from the basics of The Way that challenge assumptions presumed is not the road to growth.
SO, here is the first question: “Who is the founder of Christianity?”
Here is the first response, and it is one I am use to from atheists and skeptics, but I think pride plays more of a role here — something we all exemplify ourselves:
Nope. I am a Christian because I am “what”like?
You must think we are retarded. I said Paul because I heard a debate on that once.
Let me say that if I were to have this conversation face-to-face, LKD would realize how monotone and calm I am in asking this question. The keyboard is an amazing thing, something my wife (for instance) is not immune to. She will read an email to me but put here emotional assumptions or current feelings onto the text that the original sender probably had not in any way meant to convey. (We are reprobate creatures and battle tirelessly with our dual nature with guidance from the Holy Spirit… it is natural we put onto others this emotional state we are experiencing and not the best of intentions.) In previous conversations I have shared my “legal statement” to get this point across, I will place that here for clarity, then back to the conversation:
I think the same thing is happening here so I circle back to my original introduction to reintroduce this idea:
I have already written in the OP (original post): “There is a point… but it requires honest dialogue. It may seem too simple and come across as demeaning… it is not meant to be.” I asked for honest dialogue. Do you feel like talking about Christ is a trap of some sort?
And no, I do not think you are retarded (nor do I think RT is dumb). But do I think some people, rather than coming to logical conclusions about important issues in a faith they aspire to in some way (even if it disagrees with their own opinions), obfuscate the issues at hand? Yes. Mark 8:38:
- “For whoever is ashamed of Me and of My words in this adulterous and sinful generation,the Son of Man will also be ashamed of him when He comes in the glory of His Father with the holy angels.”
I know this is VERY simplistic — again — it is NOT meant to be demeaning. Professor Jay Wegter? You want to join in for some very simple talk about the faith? The question is “Who is the founder of Christianity?” A hint from H.G. Wells:
- “I am an historian, I am not a believer, but I must confess as a historian that this penniless preacher from Nazareth is irrevocably the very center of history. ____ _____ is easily the most dominant figure in all history.”
Who was this mystery person Wells was talking about?
I’m going with The Trinity. God the Father, the Son Jesus Christ Our Lord and Savior and the Holy Spirit aka Ghost which I never cared for as a child.
Okay… I don’t don’t know why you won’t give a simple answer, but you sorta answered the second question. (the H.G. Wells quote did not encompass the doctrine of the Trinity, but simply placed Jesus Christ as this person.)
The next question is “who did Jesus claim to be, which eventually got Him crucified?
The only way to God. The Romans crucified anyone who they deemed as false kings.
He claimed to be God in fact. Right?
That takes me back to the Trinity which is God.
The Father is God. The Son is God. The Holy Spirit is God.
In Matthew 22:43, citing Psalm 110, Jesus said, “How is it then that David, speaking by the Spirit, calls him ‘Lord’ [Messiah]?” Jesus stumped his skeptical Jewish questioners by presenting then with a dilemma that blew their own neat calculations about the Messiah “Lord”(as he did in Ps. 110), when the Scriptures also say the Messiah would be the “Son of David” (which they do in 2 Samuel 7:12.)? The only answer is that the Messiah must be both a man (David’s son or offspring) and God (David’s Lord). Jesus is claiming to be both God and human, at the same time!
See also John 8:58 and 8:59 — they were gonna kill Jesus for claimeing equality with YHWH (God of the Old Testament)….
Theology 101 is fun.
I learned ALL of this starting 50 years ago and actively studied via Zion Lutheran Church and the Navigators for 20 years, you don’t forget this stuff.
Okay, continuing along the dialogue — and keeping it simple. Jesus is God, which is classically defined as:
▶ God is often conceived as the Supreme Being and principal object of faith. The concept of God as described by theologians commonly includes the attributes of omniscience (infinite knowledge), omnipotence (unlimited power), omnipresence (present everywhere), omnibenevolence (perfect goodness), divine simplicity, and eternal and necessary existence. (Wiki)
He is part of the Trinity, was involved with creating man in “Our” image (Genesis 1:26), was part of the convo with YHWH [that is the Hebrew designation for God that practicing Jews cannot say, they will put in something else there, like Adonai] on earth speaking to YHWH in heaven (“Then the LORD [YHWH] rained upon Sodom and upon Gomorrah brimstone and fire from the LORD [YHWH] out of heaven.” Genesis 19:24) all the way to Christ Himself in John 8:58 saying he is the Great “I Am” from Exodus (Exodus 3:14), getting Himself “dead” eventually.
So yes, Jesus is God (omniscience, omnipotence, omnipresence, omnibenevolence) — correctly defined by LKD as part of the Trinity, God proper because of that.
Now, here are some Scripture, where God proper is commenting on nature. I do not want to focus on them all, but rather, want to, as people who understand who Jesus CLAIMED to be — and PROVED it by resurrecting his own body…
A SIDE-NOTE FOR THE WINNER OF THE SUNDAY SCHOOL (@LKD) POP QUIZ:
Here is the Trinity involved in raising Jesus from the dead: God raised Jesus from the dead: “This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.” (Acts 2:32 KJV); The Spirit raised Jesus from the dead: “But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.” (Romans 8:11 KJV); Jesus raised his own body from the dead: “Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up. Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days? But he spake of the temple of his body.” (John 2:19-21 KJV)
…Okay, here is the portion… and I want you to ignore the age issue, but focus on Adam and Eve. And we can get to the depth in our understanding of where you differ from evolution in believing in where we came from (rocks, or the Creative Hand of God):
….Now, when we search the New Testament Scriptures, we certainly find many interesting statements Jesus made that relate to this issue. Mark 10:6 says, “But from the beginning of the creation, God ‘made them male and female.’” From this passage, we see that Jesus clearly taught that the creation was young, for Adam and Eve existed “from the beginning,” not billions of years after the universe and earth came into existence. Jesus made a similar statement in Mark 13:19 indicating that man’s sufferings started very near the beginning of creation. The parallel phrases of “from the foundation of the world” and “from the blood of Abel” in Luke 11:50–51 also indicate that Jesus placed Abel very close to the beginning of creation, not billions of years after the beginning. His Jewish listeners would have assumed this meaning in Jesus’ words, for the first-century Jewish historian Josephus indicates that the Jews of his day believed that both the first day of creation and Adam’s creation were about 5,000 years before Christ…. (http://tinyurl.com/n6eahjy)
[Added info of the prevailing views around Jesus and Moses: “In Christ’s day, the prevailing philosophy on origins included evolution and long ages of earth history. Their view, of course, was not Darwinian evolution, but it held that the earth and the universe, acting on itself by the forces of nature (which were given names by some) had organized itself into its present state, and was responsible for all of life. The same was true for the philosophy of Moses’ day, as he prepared the book of Genesis.”]… (http://tinyurl.com/lcavpwn)
The most basic thing I want to glean from God’s (Jesus’) own lips is that he believed in a literal Adam and Eve — again, whether you think mankind (homo-sapiens) are millions of years old or thousands, Jesus makes clear that they were created, as He did in Genesis (making them in Our own image). I do not want to debate all the nuances you RT or LKD may have. Jesus Himself believed “a”, so you ~ by understanding ~ this have already tweaked the classical evolutionary story of “goo-to-you.”
SO THE QUESTION IS THIS: “Did Jesus believe in a historical Adam and Eve?”
This is where the conversation effectively ended. Many people do not want to submit all parts of their thinking under God. Jesus believed in a literal Adam and Eve. This goes against evolutionary theory as many understand it. They have no idea what Intelligent Design is and how it responds to many of the issues in an acceptance of an unBiblical theistic evolution.
An Aside for those that LOVE the Bible and their Creator — In talking to Dr Edgar Andrews (see his bio) he points out some verses as well:
I will end with this interview of Dr. Andrews via Apologetics 315:
Former vice president Al Gore compared climate skeptics to apologists for old-time Bull Connor-style racism and urges that the appropriate response, in order to “win the conversation” on climate change, is to shame and shun them.
When losing an argument… pull your “race-card”
The Daily Caller notes:
The former vice president [in an interview] recalled how society succeeded in marginalizing racists and said climate change skeptics must be defeated in the same manner.
“Secondly, back to this phrase ‘win the conversation,'” he continued. “There came a time when friends or people you work with or people you were in clubs with — you’re much younger than me so you didn’t have to go through this personally — but there came a time when racist comments would come up in the course of the conversation and in years past they were just natural. Then there came a time when people would say, ‘Hey, man why do you talk that way, I mean that is wrong. I don’t go for that so don’t talk that way around me. I just don’t believe that.’ That happened in millions of conversations and slowly the conversation was won.”
Hmm, “winning a conversation” with science skeptics by treating them as miscreants, caught in the act of justifying “gross and evil” attitudes. Where have we heard this strategy before? Ah yes….
When university professors teach that race, class, gender (the liberal/progressive “Trinity”) is the lens to look through at history, socio-economics, horticulture, climate, and the like… are you really surprised about the following?
Claim: Global warming skepticism is a ‘white phenomenon’’
Related links via Climate Depot:
This use of the Race-Card is used to hurt the maturing of the black community. It is used to insulate any consequence of actions by the community. It hurts both the gravity of the real meaning of racism, and it hurts young men that otherwise would look at attacking life in a constructive manner. Via NewsBusters:
Rudy Giuliani fired back at Michael Eric Dyson on CNN’s New Day on Tuesday for the MSNBC analyst’s “white supremacy” attack on the former New York City mayor. When anchor Alisyn Camerota raised Giuliani’s supposedly “controversial comments” from Sunday’s Meet the Press on NBC, the former Republican politician underlined that he had “said the same thing the President of the United States said, and I was accused of being a racist.”
Giuliani continued by paraphrasing President Obama’s Monday night speech, where the Democrat asserted that “nobody needs good policing more than poor communities with higher crime rates.” The one-time mayor added, “When he [Obama] said it, he wasn’t accused of being a racist. When I said it, my adversary [Dyson] said I was a racist.”…
Other things said by white people who are said to be racist for saying it but the president says it as well as Tupac Shakur is this:
Pray for the family in America… it is her bedrock.
Can you imagine the polluted, destroyed world we would have if the left had their way with green energy?
Remember what the two top Google scientist in charge of their renewable energy program just said?
We came to the conclusion that even if Google and others had led the way toward a wholesale adoption of renewable energy, that switch would not have resulted in significant reductions of carbon dioxide emissions. Trying to combat climate change exclusively with today’s renewable energy technologies simply won’t work; we need a fundamentally different approach.
“Even if one were to electrify all of transport, industry, heating and so on, so much renewable generation and balancing/storage equipment would be needed to power it that astronomical new requirements for steel, concrete, copper, glass, carbon fibre, neodymium, shipping and haulage etc etc would appear. All these things are made using mammoth amounts of energy: far from achieving massive energy savings, which most plans for a renewables future rely on implicitly, we would wind up needing far more energy, which would mean even more vast renewables farms – and even more materials and energy to make and maintain them and so on. The scale of the building would be like nothing ever attempted by the human race.”
But asking someone who has swallowed this story is like beating a dead horse. They will tell me — to my face — that mankind releasing CO2 into the atmosphere is driving weather changes.
I will point out a graph that shows in the past couple of decades man has produced more CO2 combined from the previous 100-years, overlayed to the temperature staying the same for over 18-years (in fact, falling a bit since 2005), and this MAJOR, FOUNDATIONAL belief being shown false doesn’t sway their “belief” towards rethinking their previously held paradigm.
Via Jihad Watch:
- …This photo comes from Hamas-linked CAIR-Florida’s “14th Annual Banquet Rooted in Faith” in Tampa yesterday, courtesy of an anonymous reader who was at the banquet. It is not the first time Hamas-linked CAIR, designated a terror organization by the United Arab Emirates, has discouraged Muslims from talking to the FBI…
Jihad Watch director Robert Spencer explains the connections between the Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR) and the jihad terror group Hamas. (H/T – Creeping Sharia)